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kyudo - krypto & finanse
Podatki od kryptowalut - kiedy najczęściej dochodzi do kontroli skarbowy - przykłady i przypadki
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It is very possible that in a few months we will be able to sell crypto on completely zero taxes in Poland, completely legally. Good morning, I warmly welcome you. I have Maciej Grzegorczyk here, he is head of tax polandscription and he will help us here and explain a few things about crypto taxes. The topic is quite important because it will be necessary to calculate soon, because if not, Ziobro will come and do unpleasant things to you on the portfolio. Hi Maciej, nice to meet you. Hi, as Q2 said, Maciej Grzegorczyk, legal advisor of the tax office from the KHG office. I run the crypto.
pl website and YouTube channel and I am the head of tax office of Krypsiony. Krypsiony is a company that makes it easier to calculate with crypto. Today we will talk about taxes and about such a practical approach to crypto from this point of view. I promise it will not be boring, we will throw out specific numbers, statistics and what is the real chance that someone will get a check. What are they asking about as part of such a control? Great, great, that's what it's about, because here, talking to my community, they also wanted to know more specific examples of how it all works.
So, as you can see, we have a specialist with us here and it will be meaty, there will be a lot of meat presented, so at the very beginning, maybe for those who don't know yet, this is the first time I'm going to talk about this video, tell me more or less about the general picture, how this crypto works in Poland, because we know that it is a quite convenient solution, because when and how we pay this tax, and then we will go deeper into something more detailed and also about Krypsiony platforms.
So, at the beginning, when do we pay this tax from crypto? Yes, we pay the tax from crypto when we have an increase in revenues over the costs in the tax year, that is, to put it briefly, we sold more crypto on fiat than we bought crypto for fiat. People often ask themselves the questions of how to do the calculation, that this calculation is devilishly difficult.
I will tell you that this calculation is not difficult, Krypsiony applications allow you to generate a report and this tax report is actually one to one with regard to what we have on PIT38, because PIT38 is a tax statement that you have to submit, you do not connect any history-type connectors from your exchange to this PIT38, you just have to enter the numbers there, and these numbers you will have from the Krypsiony application, that is, within this application you can generate a tax report. Now, how does it work? Very simply, you connect to your exchange account and within this connection we have access to your history.
If you do not want to give access to your account to your history, because you are afraid, although this is a standard connection through API, and we do not have the opportunity to make any transactions on your account, you can generate a CSV from a given exchange and within this CSV you also upload it and we generate such a tax report. You have the numbers, you enter them into PIT38, you send your tax statement and that is all you need to know in terms of such a basic calculation.
We pay the tax until the end of April next year, so if we currently have 2023, then today's transactions, if you buy crypto for 1000 PLN today, then you will have to pay this 1000 PLN until the end of April 2024, even if you do not sell these crypto currencies, so even if you do not go to fiat, regardless of whether you go to fiat as you will have them on the exchange account or on a bank account, the purchase itself, the law says that it is necessary to report, it is necessary to issue a tax report, but again, from the practice of the reason, that no one has yet been punished for the lack of such a report, i.
e. for the lack of filing PIT despite the fact that there is a duty, because this is not my interpretation, we only have Article 54 of the Tax Code which says that we can also be punished for not filing these tax statements, but again, practice and theory, in practice, no one gets it, but formally, this PIT38 should be filed. Yes, so even though there is no penalty, do not go to YOLO, just listen to it, because you have to pay these taxes in some way. But you know what, here your application, your program helps a lot when we are doing everything on DEX and we go out to fiat somewhere, then it all counts very well.
The question is what when we work on DEX, we have some staking, we have airdrops, we have all kinds of transactions that are not made there and also the question of how to show whether we have to write it down, how does it count, how to behave, how to present it.
Ok, so yes, the controllers are interested in how you touch crypto for fiat and how you get out of crypto for fiat, so if you go into CEX or you are at any office and you buy crypto, these are your proofs of raising costs on virtual currencies, so you just bought crypto, and what you will do with it later, your crypto exchange is tax-neutral, so all trading on DEX, crypto to crypto is tax-neutral. But the first question that you asked appears, what about staking? Well, staking is such a problem that it is not known whether this staking should be calculated on virtual currencies or not.
I would like to remind you that unfortunately the current practice of the National Tax Administration is such that as part of tax interpretation, the tax office has to experience a lot of things, so they do not want to interpret what staking is, but to make the tax office see whether staking is a exchange on virtual currencies, whether it should be calculated in another way, so that the use has a different institution, it comes to the expulsion of the sense of these tax interpretations, but again, let's get to practice.
Controllers do not know each other on crypto, there are few controllers who know each other, and among those who know each other, they are more aware of what trading is, and they do not know other mechanisms, and I don't even see that they want to know. Those controllers I had were not interested in staking at all, we all developed as a neutral tax, so this staking as a neutral tax, whether it is correct or not, unfortunately at this point I do not know yet, because the tax interpretation is unfortunately not yet decided to date. I hope that next time we meet, I will tell you what this interpretation can do.
Here I say that in practice we calculate it neutrally and no one has problems with this. The same with airdrops. With airdrops there is a situation that if you get a drop, but in fact it is a drop in the amount of decentralized currency, so the project is decentralized, so a little bit like you had crypto and it went to fork, so you had an apple and an apple grew out of it, and then you dropped another apple.
It's all neutral tax, but if you get a drop from a company, so a company gives you crypto currency as part of this drop, then you can recognize that it is either an order made for the company's thing or it is a gift, and although it is in the crypto currency, it also depends on tax. We made such a interpretation report, we wanted to argue that crypto currencies do not enter the tax law, but it does not come from the drop and the gift. Unfortunately, they told us that despite the fact that the law says what it regulates, it regulates, among other things, the transfer of money and property rights.
And it was said that unfortunately, but they treat crypto as a property right on the ground, and already at the moment when I give you one bitcoin, I will be so happy, it is unfortunately a form of receiving this bitcoin, paying income tax. You can guess what some of you now have, at the moment of receiving bitcoin, someone already has a tax to pay, and then when it sells, it still has 19% tax. This is not the case, because there is such a specific barter construction.
In any case, in other interpretations that we received, we were told that the value that a person gets, or the value of the invoice that he or she puts out, can be written into the cost. And what is the practice? I give you one bitcoin worth about, let's say, 100,000 zlotys for the same account, and you pay a tax of this gift at a height of 100,000 zlotys. Let's say it's a gift, so we have a value of the base of tax from 100,000 zlotys. And now you sell this bitcoin after a month when it is worth 120,000. You have 120,000 income, and you write your value as a cost from this moment of gift.
So you will only pay 19% of 20,000 from this excess rate. So this is what it looks like in practice. Airdrops are also not interested in controllers, controllers are interested in the inputs and outputs of crypto fiat, so you have to focus on this.
But you know, maybe sometimes it happens that someone falls into someone's eyes in this office, we know our beautiful offices are beautiful and they like to torment someone and they say, show what is happening on this crypto, so that, let's say, you don't take money, or you don't make transactions, you pumped somewhere, then you have to keep, keep somewhere from our ZSKAN all the transactions we did on DEX, where we threw, what transactions we did, so that later they can show it. Maybe they don't understand what it's about, but they will probably show if it's worth doing and keeping. I will tell you some specifics again.
Imagine that we didn't have any control below the quota, so at a break, 900,000 to 1 million zlotys. Controls are at this income, so if you have an income of 100,000-200,000 zlotys, you really have to be an extraordinary cashier to get control. Think about it so honestly, how many of you know a person who had control over the crypto range? I suspect that no one knows anyone because there is no control. You know, there was one person on Discord with me who had and had to show these first transactions, what was happening there, but it was just one case.
Okay, well, as we get this control, we have been taking crypto since 2014, so not one host is behind us and as we see the statistics, it's really 100 calculations, but two people get these controls, so very, very little and they get them from people who have high incomes. Should these transactions be kept? Yes, they should be kept, but how is tax law constructed for this reason? Well, Kiodo, as I tell you as a controller, you have left-handers, these are illegal sources, so what will you say? Well, prove it to me, and I will tell you no, no, no, Kiodo, it doesn't work like that in the tax law.
We have Article 25G of the PIT law and it reverses the evidence burden. If I, as a controller, tell you you have left-handers, then you have to prove that it is not left-handers, and you can say, but I invested it 8 years ago, I don't have all these evidences anymore, I generally have nothing, tax obligation has expired. But then I say, of course, tax obligation has expired, Kiodo, but the law says that if there is more than 5 years of this source of property, then it could at least make its legitimacy probable.
Such a story from MetaMaska or generally from Wallet and Explanation, in my opinion, is probably the most probable and I wouldn't take it personally, so keep this story, but don't focus on the fact that we will definitely get control and that there will definitely be problems in this regard. Again, statistically, we have statistics from 2020, I hope you are interested, the number one person in Poland who had the highest income from crypto in 2020 is 10. 5 million zlotys. And now let's move on. Do you know what the biggest income and costs were on cryptocurrencies? First, I will tell you how it was taken, where this amount came from.
If Kiodo, each of you can take number one in terms of income and costs, it is really very simple, it is enough to get 1000 zlotys. Well, if we buy crypto for 1000 zlotys, and then we sell it for 1010 zlotys and again we buy, sell, buy, sell, then we roll with the same money. Each roll with the same money causes plus 1000, plus 1000, plus 1000, plus 1000 in income and costs, so it is much better if we do trading on stables, so we go back to stables, because if we go back to stables, it is neutral tax and we don't get into this way big amounts on PIT 38.
So, going back to my information, income and cost of the tax, I guess it is the same, was over 130 million zlotys, so someone was trading to fiat and had almost the same income as the same cost, so you can see how it looks. All the people in the first 10 had income above a million zlotys, so each income above a million zlotys was in the first 10.
And as I said, there is not much of these controls, looking at the statistics and the fact that these controls are at 900 000 to a million, over 900 000 zlotys, so in our practice it turns out that people get these controls, but I have to tell you that these controls occur on cryptocurrencies much more often, on other fields of activity, because those of you who are watching are probably traders, so traders normally do not belong to the virtual currency register, because yes, there is a virtual currency register in Poland, but you have to sign up for it only when you are doing services from the virtual currency range, so you are doing services, exchange of currencies for legal payment funds between virtual currencies and intermediaries, you are doing or running crypto wallet for someone, so you are taking orders from someone and that you will, for example, trade his heism, he was performing orders, only legal ones, he was performing his orders and you will have to keep the crypto, so this is a service in which you have to have a company, you have to sign up for the register, you are an institution and you do the whole KYC procedure, and from this range, such companies, i.
e. the items that are registered, they are much more often controlled, so just like we have only a few controls a year, as for crypto investors, i. e. those who trade standardly, only last year we had over 25 or 26, I do not remember exactly, but just these controls from the firm's range, which are registered, and there are about 500 of these companies in Poland, so you see the scale that by signing up for the register, there is a much larger number of customers at once, we are still in control of the IAML and tax control. So generally, when we earn for it, we say Lambo, then you have to worry more that someone will only know us.
But look, you just said, if we earn for it Lambo, how does the stock exchange find out that you have a lot of money? They find out from here that documents are reported to it, and what is reported to it? PITs are reported to it, so unfortunately, but we ourselves put this PIT, so if we have a lot of PITs, 38, then of course we can be out of control, but the scenario is more likely that you buy real estate for a lot of money, or you buy a car, and cars are also registered in the offices, so this information is collected by the stock exchange, if we see that you have Kiodo in the last five years on PITs, income of PLN 400,000, and we see that you buy real estate for PLN 600,000, then you have PLN 200,000 and holes, so this is a way to type you into the control, but it does not work automatically that you will definitely get a control, everything is led to typing into the control, so it is not such a zero-one method, it is always whether to type or not to type, and if we type, then maybe we will first check the tax office, we will do such activities that check it, so we will send him questions and close the whole stage, if he explains the basic information to us, we will not enter the control into it, and if we do not like the explanation, or we consider that we want to control it right away, then we send a serious review to the control and we enter this control, which will formally end as a result of the tax control, and we will see what happens next.
So this is a big relief for many people who are worried about this. I also have a popular question here, what to do when I started to degenerate in 2018, and now after watching this video, I just remembered to report any payments to crypto, what to do then, what about the previous years? Before there were cryptocurrency regulations 2. 18, 2.
19, as it was included, we have a tax interpretation that says that the costs that you generated in 2016, in general, the old costs that you did not report, you should report in the first PIT 38 that you owe him, so if you bought crypto in 2016, then in the first PIT from virtual currencies, you report the old costs, and this is the right thing to do in the first PIT that you owe him, so if you haven't touched anything for a few years, then for example your first PIT will be PIT for 2020, and this is also completely normal.
I bet you have a very standard situation, that is, you just traded but you never calculated, then you should make a correction, that is, you should deposit your old PIT 38 with a valid debt and this turns off your prohibited deeds. The point is not that the deposit of these old PITs will automatically cause some kind of control, I would not be afraid of this at all.
We also had a view that, look, if math did not pay off our taxes in the past years, for example, we know that we bought for 100,000 zlotys, and we sold only for 50,000 zlotys, so there is no tax, then wouldn't it be enough to deposit all this in the current PIT? Do we have to make corrections of the old PITs? Unfortunately, we were told that we have to. The law also points to this, I tried to argue that mathematically it is the same, because in fact mathematically it is the same.
Since the tax did not appear in the past, now, when we calculate it, it will be the same, but unfortunately we were told that we stick to the law, not mathematics in such a condition that we have to make these corrections.
You know, now various kinds of cashback cards are popular, we get crypto for this, and the question is, if we use these various cards, for example, now you can have a cashback card with a collector, and we throw our shitcoin there, we want to get rid of it and pay it in the store, then what? Then we have to pay taxes, from this we have to get crypto? Formally, what do you think about the sale of virtual currency? The sale of virtual currency is in fact a replacement for its real payment center, for the replacement for the property law or regulation of its obligations.
So yes, the payment from the card is regulation of obligations and it should be counted up to PIT 38, but again, in practice, in no way, they took this information from the card from us. Next thing, a lot is led to whether you, paying this card, as if who gave you this card, who is doing this payment service for you, who has access to these data, and usually these are foreign companies and as part of these foreign companies, there is no information transferred to the Polish Treasury Office, but there are implemented directives. The current directive that will now be implemented is DAT7 and it concerns e-commerce platforms.
So if you use your card on some e-commerce platform and this platform actually adapts to this directive, it should report it to the Polish Treasury, so it should be a transmission of this information from the country where it has its headquarters to the Polish Treasury, but I think it can still be a dead law. I am more concerned about DAT8. DAT8 is a directive that will be dedicated to cryptocurrencies and it will require from cryptocurrencies, including from the cryptocurrency exchange, reporting transactions and reporting of the assets by its customers, but this directive is planned for 2026, so the perspective of time is still quite far.
I know that it is hard for you to believe that something like this can happen in the context of what I remember from 2019. Imagine that we already had information transferred, that something like this can take place in one justification for the MLS law, justification on the 70th page, somewhere very, very far away, there was information that it was planned to introduce individual cryptocurrency portfolios, that is, to have portfolios reported and they will definitely strive for it. I think that this story will catch us in the future, that is, that this anonymity for crypto will unfortunately end. I am an absolute opponent of this.
I am openly saying that I am a fan of crypto for DAT8 and technical things, I am not interested in crypto because of legal reasons. I love the functionality that they give and this freedom, this freedom, so I will not be a fan of regulation of terms here. I am an opponent, but I say which way it is going, and it is going in the direction of reporting.
I think that it will never be possible to close these cryptocurrencies so tightly with everything, but look, for example, the limit of 1,000 euros when you do not have to do KYC procedures, unless you have a permanent economic relationship with someone, if you do not have any suspicion of money laundering against someone, then this limit will disappear, this limit will disappear in two years, that is, each transaction, at least formally, will require the so-called KYC, because otherwise we will not do it. We will see how the companies will adapt to it, we will see the final form of regulations, but as there are announcements, unfortunately this limit will disappear and I am convinced that it will disappear.
You know, recently there was news that Binance has invited to Poland and the company is here already, do you think that this will be the reason for more smuggling and having more information and tax offices? Listen, all the time the treasury could return to Binance abroad, but to be completely honest, I have not met with any such case here. On the other hand, I see the practice of Binance, which also cooperates with the Polish prosecutor's office. The Polish prosecutor's office issued a decision on blocking funds, blocking cryptocurrencies.
I know it's hard for you to believe it, but really such decisions are issued that if we see after the blockchain analysis that there was some fraud, that something went through Skamy, it was on the wallet of Binance and it is visible that it is attributed to some user, because Binance already knows about it in this area. They block it and there is no problem with it. So if they cooperate with the tax agencies, why shouldn't they cooperate with the treasury agencies? And now, since Binance is in Poland, Binance requires Polish users to accept this regulation. We have Article 45 of the National Tax Administration Act, which gives the basis for asking Binance about information about users.
So we think that Binance will exchange this information with Poland. I can tell you that for now, the subject that requires information from cryptocurrencies has become GIF. Imagine that now GIF, the Polish AML office, in January, conducted an action where it asked several cryptocurrencies in Poland about several example wallets that they used to serve their customers. They did not ask about the data of the customers, they only asked about the wallets, because GIF and the prosecutor's office and the tax agencies begin to use such a tool, Data Walk. You can type in Google Data Walk, this is a platform that also has functions related to cryptocurrencies integrated. And within these functions, you can report blockchain cryptocurrencies that were mixed into some frauds. OK, so this does not change much.
Binance in Poland is. . . If they wanted to add us, they would add us anyway. Yes, unfortunately. So there is also such an incident. What if I go to some project and I do not pay for the money, but I work honestly? And with this honest work, they will want to pay me a pension in crypto. So how does it look? How is it with tax? Does it change the situation? It changes the situation so much that your calculation is a little more troublesome. But yes, if you work with a lot of work, you can get a minimum salary only in the fiduciary currency. Everything you get above can be received in crypto. But paying in crypto does not make you suddenly avoid taxing.
So you will have tax only when you sell this crypto. This is one of the greatest myths that people have. I'm sending you a little bit to what I said at the beginning, that is, with this gift. But I will explain it to you again. I have an economic activity and I put a invoice on Kiodo. I say Kiodo, pay me for my services, three thousand zlotys. But in crypto. And you send me a bitcoins fragment to me. I put out an invoice, so I pay from this invoice according to my other income costs, a deposit for the income tax.
Let's say I didn't earn anything else, this is my only invoice in a given month, so I pay a deposit from those three thousand zlotys, and we will make a social security deposit. Now I got this bitcoins fragment from you and I sell it on the market. When I sell it, I have an income as much as I sold this bitcoins fragment. And my cost is the value of the invoice. That's why there is no double taxing here and this is the correct calculation of the profits from crypto currency when we conduct economic activity and someone pays us in crypto. Because if someone pays us in crypto, I sell my services and at the same time I buy crypto currency.
And Kiodo, on the other hand, buys a service from me and sells me crypto currency. This is what this specific barter is about. We have it confirmed by tax interpretations. The information is really certain 100% that this is how it should be counted. OK, so if someone earns in crypto and watches it, then you get into the specialities to calculate it. And the support for Binance is paid in crypto. Yes, that's what it's about. You know what? I have more questions here and the question is often how to avoid this taxing at all. And often there are foreign destinations. Not everyone knows how a tax resident becomes a citizen of a country.
Tell me, can we legally avoid it in Poland? Do we have to emigrate somewhere and set up our own life environment there? In Poland, avoiding this tax from crypto currency is such an aggressive optimization that unfortunately is against the law. So let's talk about it. But let me tell you that if it goes through. . . I can't argue with that. I can't argue with that. But it's very possible that in a few months crypto will be available on completely zero tax in Poland, completely legally. I'm waiting for the regulations, we'll see their final shape and if I get a positive tax interpretation, then everyone will be able to learn about it.
But I'm telling you, it's a melody of the future that I hope will actually go through, because they want to do something that will enable certain things. And we'll see if crypto will also be available. Okay, but let's move on to what's happening now. Now, if you want to sell your currency you should go back to the destination, to the jurisdictions that allow you to do so, or they use the lack of regulation, that is, they have a closed tax system, crypto doesn't fit in, that's why it doesn't apply to tax, because that's how it works in practice.
Or they use tax release, that is, crypto is released from tax, or where there are no capital gains, that is, we have something with capital gain and that capital gains do not apply to tax. As part of European jurisdictions, Portugal is a very popular destination, which has now made its own regulations, similar to the German one. Previously, Portugal functioned in such a way that it was an unregulated activity, that is, there were simply no crypto regulations, a closed tax system, that's why if it was an unprofessional activity, someone didn't do it often, they thought it didn't apply to tax. Now they have made regulations similar to the German ones, so if you hold crypto for over a year, then you can sell it without tax.
However, Cyprus also has clauses on tax release, tax release, crypto sales, besides that, these are also popular destinations for non-European countries, such as the United Arab Emirates, but this is a country that unfortunately is difficult to live there, it is difficult to live there.
When we are a resident of a tax haven of another country, when we have been there for over 183 days, or we have a center of life interests there, in practice, this change in the tax residence is not particularly difficult, because we put the ZAP-3 form to the head of our tax office, that is, we inform him that we stop being a Polish tax resident, we move to another country, there we get the appropriate evidence that we actually live there, that we have a tax residence there, so we rent some apartment, we set up a bank account there, it is extremely important to have a bank account there, we regulate our daily life payments, as we buy a cash register, because these are our evidences that we live there, we have air tickets, we flew to another country, this is such an ideal example, I am not saying that you have to do this, I am saying that you have to do it in a model way, so that there are no problems, and we try to make sure that we have the least connection with Poland.
If we live for 200 days in Cyprus, and in Poland we left our family, we have an apartment here, on Christmas, unfortunately, in the case of a check, in Poland it may turn out that you have a life interest center, and that you were a Polish tax resident, it is very safe to have a residence certificate of this other country, but it does not close the procedures. If Poland claims that you, Kiodał, after the transfer, you were a Polish tax resident, then the so-called MAP procedure is launched, i. e.
a procedure of mutual understanding, and then Poland with this other country, which is subject to the MAP procedure, and a lot of countries are subject to it, it is practically a procedure, wherever I look, this procedure is always used, in case of what.
And Poland with this other country agrees and establishes, that is, you are a tax resident, that so-called collision rules are used, I admit that I have never reached the last collision rules, but the last such basic collision rule is the American one, that is, if you, Kiodał, are a citizen of Poland and it is impossible to establish whether this residence certificate, or this center of life interests, or other things determine your tax residence, then we finally look for citizenship, but I say, so far we have not even had one such case, that we would reach the issue of citizenship, if someone actually lives in this other country for more than 183 days and did not leave his family here, it would not be a problem.
OK, so take your family, your lover, everyone abroad, then there will be a greater probability that no one will chase us. Yes. You know what? Now I still have such a question. I'm already wondering why I left somewhere. Aha, is it still a combination of the type of the company to establish, to send this company to Estonia, that is, in Estonia, to borrow cryptocurrencies that are almost never returned, are these tricks still used? Listen, borrowing cryptocurrencies to your company, or to another company, is neutral, tax-free, does not even apply to PCC, I also have interpretations on this, there is no problem with it, but there is a problem of another background.
If you have a company in Estonia, be in any other country, because establishing foreign companies is a completely legal activity, but this company will not have a sub-stratum of activity, it can be considered as so-called CFC, i. e. a controlled foreign unit. And what does it lead to? That despite the fact that this company is in Estonia, it can be treated as a Polish tax-free CIT together with Polish regulations, i. e. establishing a foreign company, OK, as long as it has a sub-stratum of activity there. Estonia is in the European economic area, and within this European economic area, it should carry out an important economic activity in this region.
If you, Kiodo, establish a company in Estonia, but you will still be sitting in Poland, you will not have any office there, and sorry, but no advice here that some office will prepare you documents like gathering of partners in Estonia, we have so much hospitality that these legal documents do not work. It must be a really functioning company, and then such optimization would be OK. You just have to ensure that it is a real, important economic activity carried out within this foreign company. Tell me, are NFTs treated as any other crypto, or is it different here? NFTs are not treated as any other crypto. I still think that I was the first lawyer who talked about this problem. You can see on my channel that I really informed about it a while ago.
And for me, as we did tokenization of various items, if we did tokenization and NFTs were used, these NFTs were often associated with some services. And as it is such a property law connected with a service, and it is not a virtual currency used as a payment token, because these payment tokens are virtual currency, and as it is so model, these NFTs are then subject to a defect. The point is that we have a definition of what is a virtual currency, and from this definition, which is contained in the EML law, tax laws are used. They do not use it because someone invented it, but they use it because it is a direct message. Tax laws use the EML law.
And in this definition we have that it must be guaranteed exchangeable for legal payment funds and acceptability as a exchangeable fund. And as acceptability as a exchangeable fund is, it is exchangeable for legal payment funds. What would we not say, but on a pension you can not buy crypto directly, you can not buy NFTs directly for fiat, but you can for other crypto. So we have a problem that we see that these NFTs are not a payment token, they are not exchangeable for fiat.
They have this graphic layer, they have these services issues, so absolutely NFTs are not a classic virtual currency, they can be, because I imagine that the graphic layer of NFTs has this internal issue, and it is actually used for payment or can be a financial instrument, so we would have three categories. NFTs as a legal-payment law connected with service, NFTs as a virtual currency, and NFTs as a financial instrument. Unfortunately, unfortunately we did not have any information about NFTs, I think everyone is learning about it, but the problem of NFTs is noticed on the international market, on the EU market, and they want to go straight, they are so much on In addition, there is a problem with NFT calculations. I tell everyone to be very careful with NFTs.
I am the author of the interpretation, you could read it in the articles about the PCC. If we trade in NFTs, and that was my idea, that we can use up to 6,000 zlotys for tax evasion, that is, every NFT transaction with a different crypto will be subject to evasion. This is a direct evasion as a remittance from the exchange of rights, but unfortunately they have already said that 1% of the PCC exists with such transactions. We will eventually sue this interpretation in this area and see what the result will be. Unfortunately, I hope that this 1% of the PCC can occur. Okay, now let's talk about a hypothetical situation.
Let's say I have a Discord group and it is known that in the crypto on Discord, it is very popular to make access in the form of an NFT. And let's say I want to do something like that and whoever has this NFT will be able to enter the Discord and be a user. And since I am a patriot, I want to do it in Poland, I don't want to set up companies anywhere else.
Is it a complicated operation to do something like that, to mint your NFT or set up a company, then mint an NFT? What does it look like? You can do it as a physical person or you can do it as a company or an economic activity. Everything is led to whether your behavior fulfills the goals of the economic activity, that is, whether it is an organized, continuous and profitable activity. Unfortunately, I think it will fulfill these goals, because it is building a certain society, building from the scope of organization. You mint tokens and it is a neutral tax, we don't have to worry about that.
But you feel that these NFTs are access to services, right? It's hard to say otherwise. So, as it is a service, people who buy these NFTs, they pay them with this ETH, so they get to this barter. But unfortunately, if you are, if you are running an economic activity, you should calculate it taxably. And now, I will not leave you with such a general, you should calculate it taxably. What does it mean? We did it, we run our own accounting and we really do such projects. People who do it in foreign companies better come out and take the risk in terms of whether there is a company, whether it has a sub-strate of activity or not.
But in Poland, we have also done such projects. And now I will scare you, but imagine that if you sell such access to services for crypto, that someone just takes NFTs and has access to services within this, you have to pay it taxably. It does not apply to the permit of the obligation to verify the cash flow. The obligation to verify the cash flow does not exist when we have payments from the company or we have payments for bank accounts. And here, this crypto payment, it does not apply. It is not a payment for bank accounts, so we have to fill it all up and we have to think whether we are subject to VAT tax.
And we apply VAT tax when our sales exceed 200,000 PLN. So if you make a small emission, you do not exceed 200,000 PLN, then you will not be subject to VAT tax and it will be a little easier. But usually we had NFTs and their sales were so high that we paid it a much higher amount on the tax. OK, OK. So it's already presented, thank you. And one more question, one last one, let's say we will finish, we will not tire you much, the meat itself flew here, I am very happy with this conversation.
If I have one person in the economic activity and I want to settle in crypto, what transactions do I do there, do I have to have my own company portfolio strictly assigned to it? If you settle with someone in crypto, i. e. you get a payment, even though it is in crypto, you will still be selling crypto, then you will be counting on PIT 38. You should have a company crypto portfolio, but you can compare it to having a bank account. Listen, if you have an economic activity, you set up a company account, but if you make company payments from a personal account, then you know what will happen? Absolutely nothing, these are still normal costs and normal revenues.
It violates banking regulations and I can tell you about the account, but it doesn't happen too often. It does a bit of a mess on the controls, i. e. as part of the control, then you have to change two accounts, it is much better to keep it separate on a personal account and a company account, and the same is with a company portfolio. If you mix private transactions with company transactions, then suddenly one big mess will be made. But this is ultimately your decision. The regulations do not order you to have a separate portfolio, but I highly recommend that such a portfolio be there.
We have not had the opportunity to control such a portfolio within the framework of the controls we had. Okay, fantastic. So to sum up, if you want to make your life easier and to easily distribute cryptocurrencies, then the website of the Internet application is encrypted and there you will be able to easily implement a PIP from a different transaction, and everything will be done more pleasantly and easily. For you to know, the encryption application for several world transactions is completely free, so it's not that we sell it here and that everyone has to pay. Test it yourself, even on these small transactions, see how it works.
Yes, yes, and of course in the description you have a link with a 10% discount on payments and of course all the links will be given here to Maciej. If you feel like calling or complicating some crypto things, maybe you want to tokenize yourself, then you have to go to this guy, because you can see that he has a lot of knowledge. So thank you very much for this time and I think that a lot of knowledge is passed on to the users. Thank you very much, see you next time, take care. .
S K R Y B O T
Skrybot. 2023, Video transcriptions from YouTube
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